Ed&#39;s journal

Thing is, they were also building up to The Awesome. I could see it. I was waiting on the edge of my seat, then, all of a sudden, the Sucker Punch of Suckyness. Where was the Awesome?! I want my Awesome damn it! :-(

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I was thinking, that actually that co-ordinated 'stunt' earlier was the right general line. Have the sattelites go pop as the resistance 'does something cool' (UNIT weapon perhaps?) at which point there's a bit of an uprising on the uprising on the ship, which is when they set off the bombs they've been preparing all that long, and the carrier crashes, because the Doctor knows that all that's really necessary is the paradox thingummy dies.

Resistance storm the place, rescue the doctor, and are told that the paradox thing is what has to die. Cue heroic death as they killinate the machine and refold time back as it should have been. Thence onto the actual ending.

If necessary use paradox folding backy thing to blag doctor getting his mojo back (easy enough to do if you're turning back time anyway)

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Simpler than that. "So, you've got all these sattelites connecting all thos Human minds then. And these spinning orbs of death are in fact Human, not only that, but ones that have been reverted to children, therefore lacking willpower?

Yeah, they're our bitches now."

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Could have worked.
Also the 'master controls human race' connection being reversed, IMO would also have worked fairly well.

*shrug*.

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mapp.livejournal.com

Alternative Ending
The Master wins.

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Could have worked actually. But ... I think only really if they'd set it somewhere _other_ than earth. I mean, it's just too good a resource to set Dr. Who episodes on, and if they changed it to have 'master in charge' then ... well, they'd have ot put effort into future scripts to maintain continuity.

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Although, a spin off series of 'Master takes over the universe' might be rather cool. Although I'm not quite sure how you'd turn it into an episodic format. I mean, murderize, anhiliate, destroy would perhaps become a bit repetative, unless they dug up some challenge that only the Master could solve, or something.

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They had a Paradox Machine, which is all the explanation that would be needed. Time folds back, taking the Doctor and the others to the moment when it all started...

...but not the Master and the Toclafane, who are trapped inside a not-quite-real future that will never happen, caged forever without walls or fences... and perhaps even unaware that they've lost.

Although I've already seen that one done once, to excellent effect, by a certain non-Doctor Who writer. And, y'know, it would be morally untidy...

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You wanted an RTD ending without flangy plot wankery?

So did I, but then I wasn't holding out much hope in the first place. Bringing him back was inevitable, and was done really quite nicely, but then everything past that was just pissing it away again.

I reckon he has a group of writers who have cool ideas, then RTD goes away and re-imagines them in his own image. Looking at that episode, he'd just watched LOTR and thought 'why doesn't my show have a Gollum?', followed by Flash Gordon (he'll say 'homage', I say plagiarism) ;).

There was speculation here that the Master had put his own hand in that bubble tube in the interim, or that he did some kind of mind meld with either the woman or the ring, or both.

alternate 1:
Jack doesn't die at any point during the episode, as the viewers really don't need reminding again that he's immortal.

The good guys sabotage the device and send all the drones (which you never find out what they are, thankyouverymuch) back to their timezone before teleporting back to earth before the sky fortress crashes.

The Master dashes back to the TARDIS and performs a last minute modification to the PARADOX machine, allowing the TARDIS to exist in two time streams at once. He then jettisons the faulty TARDIS/base and uses the Paradox machine in the duplicate to timehop to sometime in the past year where he can hide and carry out repairs.

Good guys see the 'wrong' TARDIS/Skybase crash and burn, the drone things evaporate, and assume absolute victory. Doctor gets all angsty over possibly losing his only friend, etc.

alternate 2:
Jack is flung out an airlock and plummets 45,000 feet to his doom, splattered to a fine goo, he seeps through cracks in the earth and takes ironically takes just over 100 trillion years to reform.

There's some fighting, the drones form a airtight sphere around the Master and bear him away, possibly via a portal created by the TARDIS. The Doctor hooks the Master's screwdriver through Archangel to de-age all the remaining drones, at which point they all get squished inside those small containers as they return to their true form/size - threat over.

Alternate 3:
As the Doctor's assistant can't actually *speak* anything other than English, her trips over the world end with nearly everyone thinking 'Trogdor'. At which point a dragon comes and burninates everyone.

Ugh, enough for now. Given more than five minutes forethought, I could probably re-write the past four(?) seasons and make them good. Which I am more and more tempted to try and do.

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which you never find out what they are, thankyouverymuch

Would need a re-write of the previous episode. After that, we either needed to find out what they were, or at the very least how The Master found them / where they came from.

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Why? Why does it need to be explained at all?

Besides, in that scenario, some survive, so it can be explained later if necessary ;)

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Why? Why does it need to be explained at all?

Because otherwise there's a *huge* WTF, as they've appeared out of no-where with no introduction, or explanation or anything really. If they'd gotten as little a nod as the Doctor going "OMG, they're the thingy's from Whatsit!" that would have been OK. But there was a big point of the Doctor going "I haven't a *clue* what the hell they are, except Not What He Claims", and that needed Righting.

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I'm not from the school of absolutely-everything-needs-explaining-to-the viewers-immediately-or-they'll-lose-interest.

One thing that has annoyed me about the episodes I've seen is that RTD seems intent to leave no stone unturned in exposition.

I'd prefer to be left thinking what were those things, and not have them expanded upon them until they reappear in a future episode.

Having the doctor be unsure of something is a refreshing change. Having the Master knowing more than him about certain things within the universe would add a great dynamic to their relationship.

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It doesn't need explaining immediately, but does need explaining at some point. And since I'll be very surprised if they come back (given what they were), it needed to happen at some point in the two episodes.

Having the doctor be unsure of something is a refreshing change.

Oh, I agree, but it's so unusual that it needs further explanation. It also needs to be kept rare, otherwise it stops being a refreshing change.

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And since I'll be very surprised if they come back (given what they were), it needed to happen at some point in the two episodes

This is getting to be a silly hijack of Ed's thread, but - given it was *my* alternate ending, and they just saved the Master from his demise, they would indeed return later as his prime henchmen. Possibly seeded throughout the following season, like Star Wars drones (or agents of the Shadows á la B5) - roaming random planets throughout time scouting for signs of the Doctor, or putting various aspects of the Master's schemes into place. :D

Another one of my pet peeves is the 'villain of the week', where all these wonderful bad guys are written in and out again (only to be brought back by flange if they prove popular).

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You're "re-write the ending of that episode" has remarkable scope to it... ;-P

Hmmm... While I'm generally in favor of proper, on-going plot. I'm not convinced I want more from Dr Who than we're currently getting. I want it to be experimental, and free to go off to weird & wacky things without much connection to the over arching plot.

Of course, it actually takes some writer skill to do that without devolving into "Monster of the week".

I'd also like less stuff to do with modern day earth, particularly anything big. It's really getting to the stage where modern day earth in the Who-verse must have some notable cultural differences. We're not shown the repercussions of all the stuff that's gone down, and it's beginning to feel fake.

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Any decent ending should have enough scope to go in any number of directions, and leave the viewers guessing what exactly is going to come of it - we're sci-fi geeks, after all - we need to be able to theorise what should happen next ;)

I agree it takes a fair whack of skilled writing to keep it from turning into monster of the week, but I also think Doctor Who deserves - and doesn't have enough of - that type of writing. If the series had been written by that other guy, it may have been something special.

I'm with you on the Earth thing. I can only assume it's only by RTD's conscious effort that so much takes place on Earth, as even with a budget that must be infantessimal compared to Modern Who, Classic Who went to a multitude of places, and could quite happily use the viewer's imagination to turn a cheap set into a hostile planet.

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Any decent ending should have enough scope to go in any number of directions, and leave the viewers guessing what exactly is going to come of it

Normally yes, but at the end of season, I want things to be a bit more tidied up & resolved. Only things that should still be going then are the foreshadowing for next seasons over plot, or any over plot that's intended for several seasons (which isn't really Who style, and is also best at a quiet period for the season break).

Or you go for the out & out obvious cliff hanger.

I think RTD does stuff on earth so that the unwashed masses feel more of a connection to the events. Problem is, he also wants to do Epic Plot. These don't work well together. The Big Dalek Invasion at the end of season one could have been good epic, because you can leave with the feeling that the society has been permanently changed by what happened. You can't do that on modern day earth (past earth is difficult as well).

Plus, Modern day earth non-epic is what Torchwood should be about. We don't need two shows about it! (OK, RTD can't be trusted to keep Torchwood non-epic, that's a different issue).

Basically, the Who'verse deserves a better writer than RTD at the helm. I'll concede to let him write some episodes as long as he's got someone better than him to say "No, that's Crap".

Oh, and if we have another Dr Who "Last of the Daleks" episode, I'll scream. We've had four "these are the last of all the Daleks" episodes now, Enough is Enough. You've got one left to kill off, have Torchwood do it, at least it'll be different. Then put them away until such a time as the full race & Gallifrey comes back.

Ditto with the "New Cybermen" They're Gone Now. Don't Bring Them Back. You want Cybermen, bring the old ones out to play. You want re-occurring villains? You have plenty of funky ones from the new stuff I'm sure. Maybe it's time for a truly new arch villain race / person. And two / three seasons down the line, you can bring the Master back for more fun.

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Darn, should make more care to say everything in one comment.

The Doctor hooks the Master's screwdriver through Archangel to de-age all the remaining drones, at which point they all get squished inside those small containers as they return to their true form/size - threat over.

The Doctor? Willfully killing? I think not....

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The Doctor is a psychotic bastard - and it's not as if genocide is beyond him, especially to save humanity.

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The Doctor is a psychotic bastard - and it's not as if genocide is beyond him, especially to save humanity.

Wait, what?

He's shown time & time again that he's deeply, deeply, unwilling to kill. That's why him going Postal in Dalek was such a big thing. That's why him killing off the daleks & the time lords Really Fucked Him Up, despite having no choice.

Yes, sometimes he's wrong, like in the family of blood episodes, and causes more death than he prevents. But it's not through lack of trying.

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linamishima.livejournal.com

But some doctors, like the 7th (McCoy) did occasionally show a darker side to them. However deliberate mass killing is certainly not his style, he may allow it as an unfortunate side effect, but never wilfully perform it directly.

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Exactly.

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The point is, though, once they're out of the way, and the Paradox thing is destroyed, they'll all go away anyway, and he'll never have killed them.

If you want the kids-program ending, when they revert they can crack out of the shells like little fluffy chicks.

In case you missed the original point, though, Alternate version 2 was my bloodthirsty ending ;)

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cthulahoops.livejournal.com

alternate 2:
Jack is flung out an airlock and plummets 45,000 feet to his doom, splattered to a fine goo, he seeps through cracks in the earth and takes ironically takes just over 100 trillion years to reform.

I seem to be completely alone in most of my opinions on this episode (I may write a post), but boy do I want to see that. But only if we get a legally binding signed contract from the BBC guaranteeing that the doctor won't travel into the future to rescue him.

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fearmeforiampink

Two here; one easy, and one good ~~(much like my last couple of girlfriends)~~

Easy: The Doctor uses the telepathic field to take control of the master, and from there manages to defeat him. Still somewhat deus ex'y, but less so, and less similar to Rose's apotheosis. Also means that you could have some fun interactions with the Doctor's ethics when he's controlling the Master.

Good: The human races gets down with its ~~bad~~ future self - contacting the toclafane, breaking through their childlikeness, showing them what they're doing, and as a result the toclafane mass suicide/defeat the master/whatever.

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Both of these work well. The Archangel / Telepathic Field is something that I liked - turning the Master's works back on him - but the way RTD handled it was annoying, to say the least.

As the entire human race is wired into the field, taking control of it and drawing the Toclafane in as well... that would indeed work nicely...

To be honest, though, however it ended there was going to be a big red Reset button. Had to be, really, from the moment they introduced a "Paradox Machine" and unleashed the Toclafane...

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The Reset wasn't the problem. The problem was the god like being.

"God Like Beings. Just Say No."

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Great enemies, poor heroes. Yep.

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shakalooloo.livejournal.com

I was waiting for a crocodile, clock ticking away in its belly, to eat the Master. It would've fitted with the general direction the plot took...

And if the 'eye of the storm' airbase resisted the backsetting of time, but the outside world was reset, does that mean that people who were on Earth before the president was shot but at the time of the master's defeat were aboard the base have now been duplicated?

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...you know, with a writer who wasn't RTD, that might actually make a decent plot hook for a future story.

"We unwound time, you see. Undid what was done, tried to save the world. And we succeeded. You were standing on the borderline when that happened though, in the wrong place at just the wrong moment.

Your life unravelled along with the world, and now there's really no way to stitch it together again.

...I'm sorry. I'm so sorry..."

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mcnazgul.livejournal.com

Awesome-osity was rising. The Toclafane as future humans was a nice touch. Jones becoming polylingual can be flanged by the TARDIS omniglot effect which previous Doc did to Wose fairly early on.

Collective telepathy of humans combined with Archangel's mind control would have gone very badly IMHO. So you have this bunch of people who are obeying Harold Saxon and they're all thinking about the same thing...

Why didn't Paris Hilton suddenly become godlike? Or worse, The Master?

(actually that would have been nice, The Master has one of those OMG I'm suddenly infinitely powerful, I want to stop the drums... erases himself out the timestream, foops the Paradox Machine and time rewinds... Master can come back after a brief sojourn in the Void (hey, The Daleks did it) and the plot arc surprises people instead of having the Doctor doing a credible Gandalf the White impression).

I was waiting for the two TARDIS thing to happen - which would have been a nice tie-in to the SIDRAT/TARDIS thing mentioned in War Games.

Kind of expected Evil Assistant to shoot Master but also expected him to regenerate anyway. The Flash Gordon ending was a bit 'nnngh!' but again we've seen this kind of trickery before (Deadly Assassin) so again no big surprises.

Having the Titanic hit the TARDIS was a very very nice touch.

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The Flash Gordon ending was a bit 'nnngh!'

While the imagery is straight out of that film. It's only irritating if the plot is.

I read that bit as the Doctor's Mrs picking up the ring, in a "Shooting me was a pre-planned thing, the ring is my way out. The Doctor was right about me not killing myself Dead after all".

Which would be Awesome.

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I mean Masters Mrs, obviously. *Doh*

Curse you LJ, for your lack of editing!!

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Now, if they turn the 'master resurrection' thing into a subtext plot for the entire next season of Dr. Who, then IMO _that_ would be cool. OK, so it's a bit voldemort, but at least it'd be less shit than the average of RTDs writings.

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Please don't joke - given how derivative some of RTD's stuff has been so far, I wouldn't rule out the Master having a set of horcruxes lying about the universe.

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ool272.livejournal.com

Not that I've seen this episode (the season has only just started in Canada), but I've never really cared for the new Who basically because it was clear from day 1 that they had absolutely no reservations about pulling this kind of crap. It's the kiss of death for me when it comes to liking shows.

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It's a shame really. Some of the episodes have been really, really good. But the "Someone turns into a God, Fixes Everything, and then becomes normal again" really leaves a sour taste, poisoning that particular story.

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ehrine.livejournal.com

However muc RTDs scripts piss you off this season, make sure you watch "Blink", "Human Nature" and "Family of Blood". None are RTD (and it shows) and all 3 qualify as some of the best Dr Who I've seen.

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phlebas.livejournal.com

And the BBC's marketing department are surely missing a trick by releasing all three of them on the same dvd!

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